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Post by Toto Gamboa on Feb 19, 2009 4:55:25 GMT
Hello guys, are there free/open mobile electronic guides for PH wild birds that we can use in our mobile phones or netbooks when we go out there in the field for proper bird identifications?
If no one has it, I'd like to start working on it during my free time.
I am thinking it should be open and portable enough with decent searching mechanism to support various formats either DOC, HTML or PDF so it can be loaded up to any mobile phone, PDAs, netbooks or laptops easily.
But if one is already available here, might as well use that ;D
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Post by Edu Lorenzo Jr on Feb 19, 2009 10:32:34 GMT
Throw in some bird songs while your'e at it toto.
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Post by Toto Gamboa on Feb 19, 2009 11:42:53 GMT
Throw in some bird songs while your'e at it toto. ahhhm. only if you will help me. but am not sure if no one has it til now. If someone already has it, I might as well use that one
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Post by Eric Patdu on Feb 19, 2009 12:00:25 GMT
Hello Toto, Great idea! But the main obstacle you will encounter in making one is where to get photos/illustrations that are royalty free. ;D I came up with that idea too when I first joined WBCP. I was thinking of scanning the field guide illustrations but was advised about copyrights too.
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Post by Toto Gamboa on Feb 19, 2009 12:19:17 GMT
We need not worry about copyright i guess. How about we make use of the PBPF site's resources? Since it is available online, we can make it available offline too
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Post by Edu Lorenzo Jr on Feb 19, 2009 12:59:52 GMT
an offline bird ID guide. Interesting. Sige Toto, sali ako dyan. WM6? I haven't played with handling digital audio i a while (puro business apps kasi) but I think I can add a birdsong ID module for you. IF, as you have said, it hasn't been done yet.
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Post by Ding Carpio on Feb 19, 2009 22:01:20 GMT
Now, here's an idea:
You can put in a query page where you can have a series of pull-down menus for each part of the bird's anatomy. For example, a pull down menu for "beak color" where the menu options are black, brown, yellow... Then another pull down for beak shape. Then another for eye... and so on.
The user can then fill in as many details as are available and when he clicks "Search", the system should go to a page showing the identified bird, with picture, the Kennedy Guide description, and audio links on the bird's chirps. Playing the chirps could then be used to attract the bird!
Now, building such a system would probably encroach on half-a-dozen copyrights. But, technically, it is possible!
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Post by Teddy Regpala on Feb 19, 2009 22:27:52 GMT
And that's one damn apps, I wonder if you can put it in an iPhone.
Anyway, as simple as it sounds like, you're seeing an app which makes use of a simple SQL database implementation. I'm thinking of a spreadsheet-like flat database, but querying multiple columns will be a challenge.
Hehehe, technical difficulties aside, I think it can be done without infringing any copyrights. Using only the information from this forum will be sufficient (not quoting any guides of course), and as long as the use of images has the artist's permissions. Bird calls will be hard ... as there's not a lot yet. Maybe you guys needs to start doing audio and/or video in addition to stills. ;D
This is a great project, if it'll push through.
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Post by Toto Gamboa on Feb 20, 2009 0:02:58 GMT
Now, here's an idea: You can put in a query page where you can have a series of pull-down menus for each part of the bird's anatomy. For example, a pull down menu for "beak color" where the menu options are black, brown, yellow... Then another pull down for beak shape. Then another for eye... and so on. The user can then fill in as many details as are available and when he clicks "Search", the system should go to a page showing the identified bird, with picture, the Kennedy Guide description, and audio links on the bird's chirps. Playing the chirps could then be used to attract the bird! This is actually what I have in mind but for an online application. I've done this kind of searching mechanism before. However, I am not sure if this can be supported on different platforms. Right off the bat, I can probably do this kind on a Windows mobilie platform. but I am not using one I am an S60 user. Iphones are different too. I'll do some research as to what technology is appropriate that is a staple in various platforms.
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Post by Teddy Regpala on Feb 20, 2009 0:11:18 GMT
Oh, you want this online? (missed it) Stick to flash or plain html then.
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Post by Toto Gamboa on Feb 20, 2009 0:21:15 GMT
Anyway, as simple as it sounds like, you're seeing an app which makes use of a simple SQL database implementation. I'm thinking of a spreadsheet-like flat database, but querying multiple columns will be a challenge. This is doable I guess. Development-wise though, I am only familiar with the Windows Mobile platfrom. If only there is internet when we go out there all the time, I would consider this to be a web application. I would assume most of the mobiles now can do web browsing one way or another. On the other hand, this can be a piloted as a web app first while the content is being built. I agree with you that PBPF content will be more than enough assuming that members are willing to contribute their intellectual properties . In time, PBPF will become the ultimate bird guide in PH with a more multi-media-like content with stills, video, audio and text. Credits will be of course prominent And that's one damn apps, I wonder if you can put it in an iPhone. Heheh. That is the challenge. If enough volunteers show up (any iPhone developer out there?) the project can support multi platforms. I should probably do some prototypes so everyone gets on board. I dunno if there are other IT guys out here who would want to have some input.
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Post by Toto Gamboa on Feb 20, 2009 0:24:54 GMT
Oh, you want this online? (missed it) Stick to flash or plain html then. no ... this should be offline. however, to facilitate contribution and build up of contents from members, it has to be done online. my idea is for members to upload content while the offline guide is being developed. Of course it would be great if the online version supports the features Sir Ding has suggested. that would be of great help.
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Post by Lydia Robledo on Feb 20, 2009 0:40:53 GMT
Not to douse water on Toto's idea, I'd still go with Neon's motto. Shoot first and ask questions later. You'd shoot it any way. The application we dream of will only soothe the excitement when one sees something different. I'd still go for the suspense. I have read so many posts in this forum and shared yoohoos and yeehahs when the experts announce that a capture is a rare one. The photographic guide in this forum is good. Nothing wets the appetite better than home cooked menus as against instant meals.
Pero I kinda like also Ding's suggestion, a bird guide with pull down menus. Those who go out in the wild should have recorders for bird calls. Yes, the sound completes the picture.
Butterflies are harder to ID and they are silent. Most of the time you have to catch them to make a proper ID. A picture will not be enough. LY;D
PS. In cases where you fail to capture what seemed like a rare bird, it is faster to jot down the details than to scramble with an electronic gadget (my opinion).
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Post by Toto Gamboa on Feb 20, 2009 0:49:47 GMT
Not to douse water on Toto's idea, I'd still go with Neon's motto. Shoot first and ask questions later. You'd shoot it any way. The application we dream of will only soothe the excitement when one sees something different. I'd still go for the suspense. I have read so many posts in this forum and shared yoohoos and yeehahs when the experts announce that a capture is a rare one. The photographic guide in this forum is good. Nothing wets the appetite better than home cooked menus as against instant meals. Pero I kinda like also Ding's suggestion, a bird guide with pull down menus. Those who go out in the wild should have recorders for bird calls. Yes, the sound completes the picture. Butterflies are harder to ID and they are silent. Most of the time you have to catch them to make a proper ID. A picture will not be enough. LY;D In cases where you fail to capture what seemed like a rare bird, it is faster to jot down the details I than to scramble with an electronic gadget. I realize ma'am lyds is quite right
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Post by Mark Itol on Feb 20, 2009 1:34:15 GMT
Very nice points, everyone. I too have been thinking of the same idea. If this project pushes through, count me in. I've had experience, though little, developing apps for Windows Mobile. As for iPhone, I'm not sure if it supports Java Midlets. If it does, then we can probably do it in Java. Windows Mobile also has support for Java Midlets, I believe. And TeLyds has a point, too.
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Post by Toto Gamboa on Feb 20, 2009 1:50:42 GMT
Very nice points, everyone. I too have been thinking of the same idea. If this project pushes through, count me in. I've had experience, though little, developing apps for Windows Mobile. As for iPhone, I'm not sure if it supports Java Midlets. If it does, then we can probably do it in Java. Windows Mobile also has support for Java Midlets, I believe. We can spread the work Mark so it becomes lighter. The goal of the application is just to get immediate info when one is out there for days or weeks without the benefit of the internet and this forum. sometimes you got the itch out there, especially for the beginners like me, to get to know the name of the bird you got and brag on your friends without them knowing you got some offline cheat-sheet. ;D When I started out, I didnt even know that the bird I got was a YVB and I thought it was some kind of wonder bird out from another planet The final verification of course is via our experts here The rarer ones are theirs to comment anyway.
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Post by Eric Patdu on Feb 20, 2009 3:08:02 GMT
Again, as Ate Lyds would put it. I don't want to douse water on this idea. But, I would suggest that you talk first with the photo owners before doing something as "big" as this. Not because photos are on the net mean that they can be used "freely" anywhere, even for a "free" application. This is what was explained to me when I first thought of a similar project. I was even thinking then of doing a simple screensaver with photos of this magnificent birds to be distribruted freely to bird watchers for starters. ;D
Personally, I think this is a great project as this would be a great help to birders.
Anyway, the forum members here might be planning on releasing a bird guide soon. Maybe, this project can complement it. *hint* *hint* *hint* ;D
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Post by Sylvia Ramos on Feb 20, 2009 6:01:25 GMT
There's a really nice app for the iPhone and iPod Touch called iBird Plus. It is SOOO nice, but covers birds of North America only. I wrote to them and suggested that they make a guide for Asia, but they said that they don't think the market is big enough. They're working on a guide for Europe next. Wow, if someone could make a guide like that, you could sell it it to tourists also. iBird Plus costs $20 -- it's cheaper than a guide book. www.ibirdexplorer.com/
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Post by Edu Lorenzo Jr on Feb 20, 2009 9:07:37 GMT
Hi guys, Not to promote other sites but the pulldown concept has been done.. for foreign birds www.rspb.org.uk/wildlife/birdidentifier/form.asp but this is an online version. i found this while researching the possibility. i made a POC (proof of concept) for the bird songs part, but I think the database will be too large for a mobile app. I have found a "birdsong repository" on the web but files are either mp3 or wav. Unless there is another compression algorithm out there for mobile phones, i am inclined to say the birdsong part for a mobile device is beyond feasible unless it is a special device other than a cellphone. As for legal implications, I believe the community has more than enough photos that can be used, of course with proper permissions and release documents.
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Post by Edu Lorenzo Jr on Feb 20, 2009 9:13:56 GMT
Anyway, as simple as it sounds like, you're seeing an app which makes use of a simple SQL database implementation. I'm thinking of a spreadsheet-like flat database, but querying multiple columns will be a challenge. This is doable I guess. Development-wise though, I am only familiar with the Windows Mobile platfrom. If only there is internet when we go out there all the time, I would consider this to be a web application. I would assume most of the mobiles now can do web browsing one way or another. On the other hand, this can be a piloted as a web app first while the content is being built. I agree with you that PBPF content will be more than enough assuming that members are willing to contribute their intellectual properties . In time, PBPF will become the ultimate bird guide in PH with a more multi-media-like content with stills, video, audio and text. Credits will be of course prominent And that's one damn apps, I wonder if you can put it in an iPhone. Heheh. That is the challenge. If enough volunteers show up (any iPhone developer out there?) the project can support multi platforms. I should probably do some prototypes so everyone gets on board. I dunno if there are other IT guys out here who would want to have some input. www.microsoft.com/sql/editions/sqlmobile/sqlmobileresources.mspxthere is a sqlserver version for mobile phones toto. But again, symbian and other Phone OSs are a different story.
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